After much confusion, aggravation and frustration I've decided that to complete my game in dim3 and make it downloadable is beginning to become impossible so I’ve decided that ill be switching to the Torque game engine as soon as I can! $100 is all my savings but the results will be phenomenal　and I'm sure that people will enjoy a torque game than a dim3 game. Sorry to put dim3 to shame but it just isn't good enough and just user friendly enough but seeing as it's free I just want to say well done Gwwda but just look at Torque compared to dim3. Sorry everyone but my game won’t be out for a long time now. Thanks for all your endless help!!

Yeah, I’ve given up with dim3 too because you need to have 10.4 and Xcode 2.1 which I don’t have. I look forward to seeing your game; will you put an Easter egg in where you get to play with rag doll physics??

MAKING A GAME IS NOT EASY

Nobody ever said it would be, nor did anyone force you to use any particular technology. If you simply asked about Torque, you wouldn't have to waste your money on what is a highly technical tool. If you can't piece together something in Dim3, you'd be foolish to even so much as assume that you could accomplish anything in Torque.

I'm sorry if this seems harsh, but it's frustrating to me that people refuse to listen and work out problems, instead of assuming that there's some "easier" solution. If you can't settle down and work out one simple system, why proceed into higher-level, higher-complexity engines?

Perhaps you should step back. Javascript is a hell of a lot easier than C.

I just dont have the money because I'm 'skint' and have no job. If I could afford Torque, I would buy it!

blobbo Wrote:How about a new sticky, folks!

MAKING A GAME IS NOT EASY

Nobody ever said it would be, nor did anyone force you to use any particular technology. If you simply asked about Torque, you wouldn't have to waste your money on what is a highly technical tool. If you can't piece together something in Dim3, you'd be foolish to even so much as assume that you could accomplish anything in Torque.

I'm sorry if this seems harsh, but it's frustrating to me that people refuse to listen and work out problems, instead of assuming that there's some "easier" solution. If you can't settle down and work out one simple system, why proceed into higher-level, higher-complexity engines?

Perhaps you should step back. Javascript is a hell of a lot easier than C.

People should use what they feel comfortable with, whether it's dim3 or Torque or Unity or whatever. That said, I completely agree with what's said above. No matter WHERE you do it, making ... and completing, a game is INCREDIBLE hard. Otherwise, there would be a million first person shooters out there, instead of 10s.

This is no slam against Torque or any other system, but dim3 is at the high-end of interaction; you never monkey with the code, you only use scripts and tools. Torque is at the low-end, it's code you must alter and compile. So, you must learn the code first and then work on altering it (you can do the same thing with dim3, but it was never the main thrust.)

All the systems that are out there can be used to make good games, and it's really up to the skill of the GAME CREATOR not us coders making engines. For instance, a good set of levels and models can make a game great better than an engine can.

For instance, a lot of newer first person shooters look better, but something like Duke or Marathon are easily as playable, and for a lot of them, more fun.

Bottom line, regardless of the engine you use (up to a point), how *good* a game is will be up to you. And they ARE NOT easy to make, start-up learning costs are high, and just starting the game is the hardest part.

[>] Brian

Another follow-up -- this thread should be elevated for everybody, not just dim3 users.

When a lot of people set out to make a game, they have in their minds that they will be the next X (doom, UT, whatever.) "X" was made by industry professionals -- who are professionals because they have 10+ years of expirence and a number of games under their belt.

These guys work in large teams, across a number of years (how long did Doom take? 3 years?), 9 to 5 (sometimes a lot more).

If this is your first game, my best advice is to start small. Learn a single enterprise first, maybe map making or model making, and just stick to basics. Make something small, a couple maps, a couple models, etc.

Starting a game, getting all the core assests working, is the hardest part. If you start with a big concept, you'll only get frustrated.

I'm not saying anybody here is doing that -- I'm just point that out as a bit of advice.

[>] Brian

After your posts I’ve realized your right that if I go and buy torque then it'll be even harder than dim3 so I guess I'll stick with dim3. Thanks guys!

Cool, are you gonna put ragdolls in??

unknown Wrote:Yeah, ive given up with dim3 too because you need to have 10.4 and xcode 2.1 which i dont have.
?

Umm... is that right?
I mean I have 10.3.9 and it works fine for me.
Also, you since when do you need xcode at all. I thought the point was that you didn't need to know code. For scripts, I just use Safari and textedit.

I might put ragdooll but that will be in version 9.0.0!!!

Dark Helmet Wrote:Umm... is that right?
I mean I have 10.3.9 and it works fine for me.
Also, you since when do you need xcode at all. I thought the point was that you didn't need to know code. For scripts, I just use Safari and textedit.

No, that's not right, it confusion from me releasing the code (a problem I though would happen! )

dim3 is meant to be the opposite of buying a "professional" engine, i.e., you have to go into the code to make your game. All you are supposed to need is the binary, which runs on 10.3 on up. The code is open-source just because that's the right thing to do, and if you really want to, you can edit it.

Otherwise, you DO NOT need the code, nor do you need to compile it. Everything you see in the demo is setup in scripts. Just edit the scripts, maps, models, etc. The whole point of dim3 is to be completely editable without the code.

[>] Brian

>this thread should be elevated for everybody, not just dim3 users.
Brian, I've moved the thread to this message board (Tools) because I agree with what you said. I also increased Blobbo's warning message to a larger font so that future generations can learn from his wise words.

In addition, I've played 'Elementary School Teacher' by fixing the lazy typos, etc. of a few posts here. For homework, I will assign as reading the following thread:
http://www.idevgames.com/forum/announcement.php?f=60
This week's quiz will focus on the sections "Start Small", and "Slow Down." Anyone failing the quiz will need to stay after school and write on the board 1,000 times, "I will strive to be the best game developer that I can while doing my best to follow the forum advice."

Cheers,

p.s. If 3D has your head in a daze, then perhaps you should consider working on 2D games for a while. Once you learn the ropes, move on to 3D. (BTW, I started 2D game programming in 1982, and I'm STILL learning the ropes!)

Quote:If 3D has your head in a daze, then perhaps you should consider working on 2D games for a while.

Ah heck! I don't even understand 2D vector math yet!